...and what about having practical experience AFTER academic qualification? how can you have practical experience without (or with very little) academic preparation?...Before you practice something, you have to learn about it. Ignorance: this is where "geometras win". Try and find a geometra in another european country....good luck....they DO NOT exist!!!
Badger, perhaps for a geothermal project you should have asked a mechanical engineer? I did not say that architects can do everything...architects deal with architecture (restoration, new design, materials, etc) and so they should be employed in their field (ie, restoration work in this topic), but for advise on heating systems an engineer would be the right professional to employ. Going back to the original question: and what are geometras for? What was the core of their 'academic' qualification? It will be difficult to find an answer...
Architect or Geometra? Architect!!! And not just beacause I am one of them....! I totally agree with Gala Placidia, esp when she says that architects "can provide you with design solutions that many people will not imagine. They will also save you money by giving you correct and efficient advice." However, if you prefer to put your restoration project in the hand of someone who just attended high school (oh yes, in Italy you become a geometra at the age of 18, after high school, with no further qualifications..!!!) why hiring an architect as well? You certainly don't need to employ both, adding the two % and spending a lot of money unnecessarily. Architects can do everything in the building process, from design, to permissions, to site work - with high qualification. And geometra's fees seem cheaper but they are not: ask your builder the % he gives to your geometra under the table!!(of course he won't tell you!) This is the little trick that makes them 'cheaper'....wake up!! I am sorry, but alan h is totally wrong: "The Geometra is a more practical man -...... - he is part design technician, part engineer and part project manager". Being part this and part that...he is basically not able to tackle an important task such as a restoration project, at least not from a professional point of view. And adriatica....well, some truth about corruption, but the rest is total cynical and delirious. Then, as Gala said, in all professions, there are good one and bad ones, but, please, it's time you all know the difference! Have a look at this: http://www.tuscany-umbria-architect.com/architect-or-geometra/-115 and then follow the link, it will explain once and for all the famous mistery: architect or geometra? Don't get fooled by those who tell you that "they are the same, but geometras are cheaper..."
I wonder why you (not just you pendy, but pretty much all the people in this blog) keep employing geometras if they are even more expensive than architects!!!..and as you say, they leave bits of the work out...and, I add, are not qualified. Would you employ a surveyor to do up your house in the UK?? Do you know they become 'geometras' at the age of 18? What qualification do you expect they have??? marco (sorry about the outburst!)
Hi, on the contrary, I think now it's the time to buy, as prices are cheaper than they have ever been, at least here in Umbria! ...with the idea of selling when the market picks up again, possibly in 2-3 years time. Best investment are done when the market is poor...
Hi, I am an italian architect - I have been practicing for nearly 20 years. It is very simple: when you invoice a client, you charge him 1. "imponibile" (basic fee) 2. Inarcassa 2% of the "imponibile" which is indeed a compulsory contribution of the client to our pension fund 3. I.V.A. 20% (V.A.T.) on both no1-2.I hope this clarifies the matter. There is no hidden tax evasion, nor cunning way of getting money out of you - it's just the law: architects and engineers professional fees are calculated as above.Un saluto a tutti!Marco
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have a look here: www.marcocarlini.com www.tuscany-umbria-architect.com Marco
...and what about having practical experience AFTER academic qualification? how can you have practical experience without (or with very little) academic preparation?...Before you practice something, you have to learn about it. Ignorance: this is where "geometras win". Try and find a geometra in another european country....good luck....they DO NOT exist!!!
Badger, perhaps for a geothermal project you should have asked a mechanical engineer? I did not say that architects can do everything...architects deal with architecture (restoration, new design, materials, etc) and so they should be employed in their field (ie, restoration work in this topic), but for advise on heating systems an engineer would be the right professional to employ. Going back to the original question: and what are geometras for? What was the core of their 'academic' qualification? It will be difficult to find an answer...
Architect or Geometra? Architect!!! And not just beacause I am one of them....! I totally agree with Gala Placidia, esp when she says that architects "can provide you with design solutions that many people will not imagine. They will also save you money by giving you correct and efficient advice." However, if you prefer to put your restoration project in the hand of someone who just attended high school (oh yes, in Italy you become a geometra at the age of 18, after high school, with no further qualifications..!!!) why hiring an architect as well? You certainly don't need to employ both, adding the two % and spending a lot of money unnecessarily. Architects can do everything in the building process, from design, to permissions, to site work - with high qualification. And geometra's fees seem cheaper but they are not: ask your builder the % he gives to your geometra under the table!!(of course he won't tell you!) This is the little trick that makes them 'cheaper'....wake up!! I am sorry, but alan h is totally wrong: "The Geometra is a more practical man -...... - he is part design technician, part engineer and part project manager". Being part this and part that...he is basically not able to tackle an important task such as a restoration project, at least not from a professional point of view. And adriatica....well, some truth about corruption, but the rest is total cynical and delirious. Then, as Gala said, in all professions, there are good one and bad ones, but, please, it's time you all know the difference! Have a look at this: http://www.tuscany-umbria-architect.com/architect-or-geometra/-115 and then follow the link, it will explain once and for all the famous mistery: architect or geometra? Don't get fooled by those who tell you that "they are the same, but geometras are cheaper..."
I wonder why you (not just you pendy, but pretty much all the people in this blog) keep employing geometras if they are even more expensive than architects!!!..and as you say, they leave bits of the work out...and, I add, are not qualified. Would you employ a surveyor to do up your house in the UK?? Do you know they become 'geometras' at the age of 18? What qualification do you expect they have??? marco (sorry about the outburst!)
Hi, on the contrary, I think now it's the time to buy, as prices are cheaper than they have ever been, at least here in Umbria! ...with the idea of selling when the market picks up again, possibly in 2-3 years time. Best investment are done when the market is poor...
Hi, I am an italian architect - I have been practicing for nearly 20 years. It is very simple: when you invoice a client, you charge him 1. "imponibile" (basic fee) 2. Inarcassa 2% of the "imponibile" which is indeed a compulsory contribution of the client to our pension fund 3. I.V.A. 20% (V.A.T.) on both no1-2.I hope this clarifies the matter. There is no hidden tax evasion, nor cunning way of getting money out of you - it's just the law: architects and engineers professional fees are calculated as above.Un saluto a tutti!Marco