Last week I went to check on our house outside falerone: Ok House is stretching it a bit, lets say "part restored farmhouse". I was a lttle scared when I heard a noise upstairs.
Hi, I am shocked at the price of our gas from the bomolonne and want to get Italgas in fro all of the apartments. I wanted to get in touch with Italgas but the number on the site is only for gas escapes and not available from outside Italy.
That makes loads of sense. Have you all noticed how notaries sound like a horse racing commentary in monotone or is it just the ones i have worked with?
On new homes IVA is another 4% and if this is second home with no Italian residenza (as it is for many of us) IVA is a whopping 10%, but I am more interested in the actual conveyancing cost as tax is not the issue here IMHO, The notary adds little value to the transaction as he doesn't advise. The UK system provides that the lawyers carry out due diligence. A house buyer can manage without a solicitor in the UK and Italy but the Notary is obligatory in Italy Coming back to the original question, why is it so easy for ex-pats to fall into the clutches of charlatans? I think that this is because they don't understand the system. Yes you can research and reduce risk but my view is that if the system were simpler the buyer could better understand it and so reduce the occasions where they feel that they need to trust someone to say "it's OK, just sign it"
This is good legislation. In Ireland there has been a 22c charge on every bag for some time. The economic cost makes us remember that there is an environmental cost and use of poly bags has plunged. With 15 to 1000 years degrade time on poly bags for a product used for 30 minutes, there has to be more balance Even if we shop on foot we can all put a reusable bag in our pockets and Biodegradable bags will still be available
This i sa really interesting thread. Thanks fo rraising the issue to the OP. The fact is that this needs to change and, whilst it is relatively safe for locals it is unnecesarily obscure and arcane for incoming people. The system should protect everyone, not just locals: it appears to me that the system appears to be built to protect only the system itself. And the costs in man hours, time and fees are all beyond reasonable. I really don't think it's good enough for a country claiming to be a modern economy. If we could bring to bear the creativity and sheer smarts of Italians on redoing the system, we could have a world leading system, rather than a mockery. Come to think of it, maybe we should leave this to the Germans and get the Italians working on all the stuff that they are great at: beauty, design, arts, passion and of course food & wine
How frustrating Italy can be. The overwhelming weight of Italian beureaucracy just helps these people who can only be described as thieves. Not only are they stealing money, they are stealing the dream that many people have for their hard earned years ahead. There will always be thieves of course but what has to be considered is the way in which Italian system makes it easier for these thieves. Because the code is complicated and the communes are underfunded, many things can be done on a nod and a wink. The system where people can build illegally and then apply for retention, appeal and appeal again just makes for trouble. The whole way of buying a house is unneccessarily obscure and complex, making it difficult for us to understand what we are buying and how things work. Clients then need to rely on finding someone that they feel they can trust and then abdicating responsibility to them. Its a con-mans delight. So, what we need is a root and branch overhaul of the whole system and a rebuild that is credible and simple. No more notaries mumbling for an hour, fifty signature contracts and cash deals. I sold my home in the UK without even being there, over the phone and email and using DHL for documents. This would be impossible in Italy and would cost I think 4 or 5 times as much. Thank heavens the country has so much going for it that people are prepared to wade through this unneccesary nonsense and vulnerability. All of this can be changed if the government was prepared to take on the civil service and knock out the archaic, obscure and expensive inherited "system" If I sound cross, it's because I am. All of this could have been avoided for these buyers had the system been transparent and simple. At least these cruel and greedy people are in jail where they belong and lets hope they don't appeal
Hi, spent most summers in and around fermo since i was a boy. Lots of good places and I like Il Frantoio which was originally an oil press. I can't imagine why its there in the centre of town but the food is good. Leave the main piazza at the lower end, near the statue of the pope and its in a turning on the left after 100m. I know you have been to Fermo already but maybe next time. Also, my mother like Emidio, 600 m down the same road on the junction with the road that goes to the strada nuova. Workmans place and great simple, cheap food Buon appetito
Please don't fall in love with a house! There are lots of houses out there and not so many buyers. You hold all the cards until you fall in love and then you hold hardly any. In my experience as a seller, agents regardless of letters after their name or a code of practice are often less than scrupulous. They have all had a tough time and sadly this seems to have made them prepared to drop standards of behaviour. Find someone who can give you a list of clients that you can email for references and only work with them if they will do this. We actively encourage clients to speak to other residents and that gives them huge comfort. By the way, I am not selling to you on that comment as we re are NOT working in Abruzzo. I would suggest you find other Abruzzo residents and get a list of recommended agents and start again. Good luck to you and your family fabrizio
Comments posted
That makes loads of sense. Have you all noticed how notaries sound like a horse racing commentary in monotone or is it just the ones i have worked with?
On new homes IVA is another 4% and if this is second home with no Italian residenza (as it is for many of us) IVA is a whopping 10%, but I am more interested in the actual conveyancing cost as tax is not the issue here IMHO, The notary adds little value to the transaction as he doesn't advise. The UK system provides that the lawyers carry out due diligence. A house buyer can manage without a solicitor in the UK and Italy but the Notary is obligatory in Italy Coming back to the original question, why is it so easy for ex-pats to fall into the clutches of charlatans? I think that this is because they don't understand the system. Yes you can research and reduce risk but my view is that if the system were simpler the buyer could better understand it and so reduce the occasions where they feel that they need to trust someone to say "it's OK, just sign it"
This is good legislation. In Ireland there has been a 22c charge on every bag for some time. The economic cost makes us remember that there is an environmental cost and use of poly bags has plunged. With 15 to 1000 years degrade time on poly bags for a product used for 30 minutes, there has to be more balance Even if we shop on foot we can all put a reusable bag in our pockets and Biodegradable bags will still be available
This i sa really interesting thread. Thanks fo rraising the issue to the OP. The fact is that this needs to change and, whilst it is relatively safe for locals it is unnecesarily obscure and arcane for incoming people. The system should protect everyone, not just locals: it appears to me that the system appears to be built to protect only the system itself. And the costs in man hours, time and fees are all beyond reasonable. I really don't think it's good enough for a country claiming to be a modern economy. If we could bring to bear the creativity and sheer smarts of Italians on redoing the system, we could have a world leading system, rather than a mockery. Come to think of it, maybe we should leave this to the Germans and get the Italians working on all the stuff that they are great at: beauty, design, arts, passion and of course food & wine
How frustrating Italy can be. The overwhelming weight of Italian beureaucracy just helps these people who can only be described as thieves. Not only are they stealing money, they are stealing the dream that many people have for their hard earned years ahead. There will always be thieves of course but what has to be considered is the way in which Italian system makes it easier for these thieves. Because the code is complicated and the communes are underfunded, many things can be done on a nod and a wink. The system where people can build illegally and then apply for retention, appeal and appeal again just makes for trouble. The whole way of buying a house is unneccessarily obscure and complex, making it difficult for us to understand what we are buying and how things work. Clients then need to rely on finding someone that they feel they can trust and then abdicating responsibility to them. Its a con-mans delight. So, what we need is a root and branch overhaul of the whole system and a rebuild that is credible and simple. No more notaries mumbling for an hour, fifty signature contracts and cash deals. I sold my home in the UK without even being there, over the phone and email and using DHL for documents. This would be impossible in Italy and would cost I think 4 or 5 times as much. Thank heavens the country has so much going for it that people are prepared to wade through this unneccesary nonsense and vulnerability. All of this can be changed if the government was prepared to take on the civil service and knock out the archaic, obscure and expensive inherited "system" If I sound cross, it's because I am. All of this could have been avoided for these buyers had the system been transparent and simple. At least these cruel and greedy people are in jail where they belong and lets hope they don't appeal
Hi, spent most summers in and around fermo since i was a boy. Lots of good places and I like Il Frantoio which was originally an oil press. I can't imagine why its there in the centre of town but the food is good. Leave the main piazza at the lower end, near the statue of the pope and its in a turning on the left after 100m. I know you have been to Fermo already but maybe next time. Also, my mother like Emidio, 600 m down the same road on the junction with the road that goes to the strada nuova. Workmans place and great simple, cheap food Buon appetito
Thanks, Great when we help each other. Costs nothing and helps everyone fabrizio
Casciaroli in PSG, 1.5 North of the Fermo turn, not far from Lido Enjoy the well earned bath F
... Then please do post a photo of your happy family eating dinner on the terrace In bocca lupo! F
Please don't fall in love with a house! There are lots of houses out there and not so many buyers. You hold all the cards until you fall in love and then you hold hardly any. In my experience as a seller, agents regardless of letters after their name or a code of practice are often less than scrupulous. They have all had a tough time and sadly this seems to have made them prepared to drop standards of behaviour. Find someone who can give you a list of clients that you can email for references and only work with them if they will do this. We actively encourage clients to speak to other residents and that gives them huge comfort. By the way, I am not selling to you on that comment as we re are NOT working in Abruzzo. I would suggest you find other Abruzzo residents and get a list of recommended agents and start again. Good luck to you and your family fabrizio